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IMG Residency Match Forum International Medical Graduates (IMGs) discussing the residency matching process.


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  #1  
Old 05-31-2013
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Question Why some IMG dont match ? What can they do ?

This thread is to inform us on what the programs need for us to match and how we can be more competitive this year.
[[Please add on, about programs and info you have]]


1a) There are programs that sponsor Visa, and there are programs that do not sponsor Visa.

so we start with VISA

Having a GC will put you on a very nice edge with program that do offer it. But looking at the trend of US-IMG specially those who marry a citizen or go to Carribean schools. Certain program only like those type of graduates.

So having a GC/Citizenship will boost the number of IV, but will you match ? that depends on your marks. Sure you have more IV, but this year so many IMG won the GC as years before. I myself just figured out I might have no problem with Visa
Applicant X [from now on called X]---If you have no Visa issue you still will be ranked based on the importance of the same factors as those with needing Visa. but first lets look at everything in order to figure this out to make our selves more competitive.


Needing Visa:: applicant Y, from now called [Y]
Historically these type of IMG, will study harder in order to beat the mean by 1 SD in at least 1 exam if not both, mark of 250+ in a step 1 has showed these IMG will match the year they apply.

Now comparing X and Y to each other.
X applies to 20 programs, Y applies to 400. Y could apply to more since he has no Visa issues.
Now when Program director wants to IV, if he sponsors Visa he again goes down from the list he made from his pick by using the USMLE mark, specially step 1 mark as filter. He sees 100 people, invites all. For 11 or 12 positions.


Importance of Marks....
=
USMLE Marks --- more than mean 1 SD

---- Marks of 260+ on step 1 usually get IV or over those with 240. and those with 230 are over 220 and 220 over 215.
From a PD I know in a very super friendly program. “we filter based on USMLE marks, SO we look at who has 250+ on step 1. We look at their entire package first in the 3 days I am off. We look for USCE, Visa, and inivte those who meet the criteria first, and the rest later. Almost all the time, we get 1000 applications to our program, after filtering out with marks. We interview 8 per position.”
So yes if an applicant had 260 with no USCE, needing Visa he be invited over someone with 220 who does not need visa.
I hope up to know I was clear.
Now an applicant with 250 with no visa 12 month USCE is ranked and liked more with other qualities I will explain now, over some one with 270 with no USCE, needing no Visa.


Look at this
https://www.aamc.org/download/249322/data/pdws_ug.pdf
also another PD told me this
“We want smart IMG, IMGs with excellent mark , than some AMG who has no Idea about the community problem.

the program director can give marks to anything in you file.


Now Interview:::
60% of your rank comes with this.
If an applicant had 255/245, 12 month USCE but poor interview skills. He is ranked very very low.
But if that applicant has great interpersonal skills, he is ranked very high and with 8 IV and all the interviews being the same people all the time the applicant will match.


Red Flags::
1-Failures in Step 1 [the worst thing in some one careers]
2-215d lower score
3-Scores lower than mean
4-No USCE
5-No US-LOR
6-Failures in Step 2 ck
7-Scores 220 and lower for CK
8-No clinical work after graduation
9-Not being on California’s list of approved schools
10-Failing the CS exam
11-Poor Personal Statement
12-Poor CV
13-Poor Interpersonal skills

These are some of the major red flags.

Now to answer who we can improve our CV for the match.

1-USCE
2-Research
3-Step 3 [for those with low marks, failures]
4-Other countries exam
5-Try to apply within 5 years of graduation if you have red flags

I can’t tell you how to study or hold your hand while you read.
Is your life and no one will put patients in a hand of a doctor who is not knowledgeable.

Now what to do if you do not match.
1-Marry some one smart and get them to match , they will bring you in for sure.
2-Do MSc.
3-Research for life
4-Work for pharmaceutical companies
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  #2  
Old 05-31-2013
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I meant to put this thread in the IMG residency section. Please move it.
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Old 06-01-2013
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Shima because of u i need to visit this forum everyday..why u post such a valuable posts everyday? :-P
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Shima because of u i need to visit this forum everyday..why u post such a valuable posts everyday? :-P
more to ocme something i took from an assistant PD want to scan it and post it
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hi shima
even scores lower than mean
for CK?
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hi shima
even scores lower than mean
for CK?
no, and yes.

in your case
you need to work on your USCE, make your CV dedicated for Peds.

You have a great step 1 mark. I am sure with a little bit of focus on the CV, PS and more USCE you will match.
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hi shima
even scores lower than mean
for CK?

also remember this one thing, the number 1 thing, in selection is STEP 1, they first look at step 1 to distinguish who they will interview. I would not worry for your CK score, is very good.
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CV meaning research in peds
step 3 , pals etc right?
Unfortunately i dont think
i will be able toget more USCE but
definately experience of peds in
my home country. Will that be fine also?
Thanks alot Shima.
And do you know what the cut off
3 digit scores for peds programs is?

Last edited by add1; 06-01-2013 at 10:01 AM.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by add1 View Post
CV meaning research in peds
step 3 , pals etc right?
Unfortunately i dont think
i will be able toget more USCE but
definately experience of peds in
my home country. Will that be fine also?
Thanks alot Shima.
And do you know what the cut off
3 digit scores for peds programs is?
yes home peds experience is excellent. 3 digit varies. but i will tell you soon.
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what if i fail in step1 and improve my step1 score 2nd time to 240+ and USCE +all steps including step 3--any chances i will match to I.M?
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Originally Posted by docusmle9 View Post
what if i fail in step1 and improve my step1 score 2nd time to 240+ and USCE +all steps including step 3--any chances i will match to I.M?
yes for sure
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Originally Posted by docusmle9 View Post
what if i fail in step1 and improve my step1 score 2nd time to 240+ and USCE +all steps including step 3--any chances i will match to I.M?

but if you score like 210 , you are in big trouble.

try to score more than the mean, more than 250+
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Old 06-01-2013
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Default 5 top things

1) USCE
2) STEP 3
3) Research
4) CLinical work
5) Volunteering

6) marry a resident
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Quote:
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1) USCE
2) STEP 3
3) Research
4) CLinical work
5) Volunteering

6) marry a resident
don't know about the top 5 but done with the 6th one right after getting a low step 1 score..
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Old 06-02-2013
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Default Step 1 score

So a step 1 score of less than 215 is a huge setback.So what should be our minimum step 1 score range.Please reply.
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Old 06-02-2013
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Question worrying

Quote:
Originally Posted by shima View Post
9-Not being on California’s list of approved schools
My school is not on California’s list of approved schools , I think that's 'll affect me in California’s programs only , but when I was reading your topic I realized that's "ll affect my chances all over the States ,I wish I'm wrong
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My school is not on California’s list of approved schools , I think that's 'll affect me in California’s programs only , but when I was reading your topic I realized that's "ll affect my chances all over the States ,I wish I'm wrong

there are 6 states which follow California's list.

is your school NY approved at least.

what school do you go ?
what are your marks ?
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You don't need your school to be approved by California list (being disapproved is a contrary story). It's probably that no body from your school has ever applied to California and did the PTAL before, that's why it's not approved yet. I PERSONALLY asked the people at California medical board and they answered my what I wrote above. Your school will be added when the first person from your school applies the PTAL letter. They also answered, the PTAL processing will be not longer than expected.

But you need to know 2 things:
1- California is not IMG friendly at all. Even on of the most, if not the most, unfriendly state to IMGs

2- California letter (PTAL) is required by all IMGs who want to apply to California programs. The application requires social security number and about 5 months processing.
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You don't need your school to be approved by California list (being disapproved is a contrary story). It's probably that no body from your school has ever applied to California and did the PTAL before, that's why it's not approved yet. I PERSONALLY asked the people at California medical board and they answered my what I wrote above. Your school will be added when the first person from your school applies the PTAL letter. They also answered, the PTAL processing will be not longer than expected.

But you need to know 2 things:
1- California is not IMG friendly at all. Even on of the most, if not the most, unfriendly state to IMGs

2- California letter (PTAL) is required by all IMGs who want to apply to California programs. The application requires social security number and about 5 months processing.
unfortunately there are some Caribbean medical school that are not approved. some are disapproved, but many I mean like 30 schools in the Caribbean are not approved, or some European medical school which are 4 years program rather than the usual 5or6 years.
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My school is not on California’s list of approved schools , I think that's 'll affect me in California’s programs only , but when I was reading your topic I realized that's "ll affect my chances all over the States ,I wish I'm wrong

dude, do not worry, you are ok.

your school is not disapproved and you do not go Carib, you are ok. this rule does not apply to you.
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there are 6 states which follow California's list.

is your school NY approved at least.

what school do you go ?
what are your marks ?
I'm starting my USMLE journey soon when starting my intern year..
my school in YEMEN .
please , what's my chance in other states ?(i don't want cali), 's it like other applicants?
thanks
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I'm starting my USMLE journey soon when starting my intern year..
my school in YEMEN .
please , what's my chance in other states ?(i don't want cali), 's it like other applicants?
thanks
first concentrate on your exams, get high marks, than come here do your cs exam and some USCE, than worry about where to match, if you occupy your mind with useless things it will just hurt you in the end.
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  #23  
Old 06-03-2013
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Default LOR

Hi

Could any please please tell,, if I require minimum 3 LOR for each specialty prog. How Can I multiply the original LOR for those dozen of residency slots.

Is scan copy from original one would be acceptable to the director. ?

I mean technically it wouldn't be possible to print those big numbers of LOR in original for each residency position.

Thnks
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Old 06-03-2013
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Again any comment on my application for selection

IMG, 2009
MSc Public Health, UK
3 Months Research Assistant Experience (However no publication yet) UK
2 Years working Experience both in clinical and public healthcare settings, UK

Strong US Physician LOR, US
4 Months USCE , US

expected step 1,2 CS (score above average good)

What are my chances in IM or Radiology or FP. (Although 3 different competitive specialties)

Hope it doesn't look daunting.

Thanks in advance for your comments
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Originally Posted by nasser788 View Post
Again any comment on my application for selection

IMG, 2009
MSc Public Health, UK
3 Months Research Assistant Experience (However no publication yet) UK
2 Years working Experience both in clinical and public healthcare settings, UK

Strong US Physician LOR, US
4 Months USCE , US

expected step 1,2 CS (score above average good)

What are my chances in IM or Radiology or FP. (Although 3 different competitive specialties)

Hope it doesn't look daunting.

Thanks in advance for your comments
what are your scores.

and yes LOR thing is good
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Old 06-04-2013
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Quote:
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what are your scores.

and yes LOR thing is good
Dear Shima
I haven't attempt any part yet, but lets hope it with expected score of 240+ in both parts and in first attempts, so would that be a convinceble score.

many thanks
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6) marry a resident
I am already a US citizen. Marry me ?
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I am already a US citizen. Marry me ?
she is married sorry dude .... i bet he would be a resident too
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Default Hey Shima

What's with old graduates? I'm an old graduate, taking my Step 1 in July, hoping to enter Match next year. I have no USCE (planning to get some), but have 5,5 years of work experience as a primary care physician in my home country. So, no gaps after medical school. My targeted score is above 250, but 240 would be good, also
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Old 06-06-2013
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am 2008 grad, took step1: 204 and step2:206....is having some publication as a co author...what are my chances to get matched this year in family med and peds?
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Old 06-06-2013
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I agree

Hi !

Thanks for the valuable information. I just have a question.

What average mark is the cut off for a university hospital residency in step 1 and step 2 ?
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[QUOTE=sparflox;194794]am 2008 grad, took step1: 204 and step2:206....is having some publication as a co author...what are my chances to get matched this year in family med and peds?[/QUOTE

Do you need visa? Do you have USCE?
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am 2008 grad, took step1: 204 and step2:206....is having some publication as a co author...what are my chances to get matched this year in family med and peds?
depending on your USCE, Visa, LOR i can tell.

as of now, very low chance.
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Hi !

Thanks for the valuable information. I just have a question.

What average mark is the cut off for a university hospital residency in step 1 and step 2 ?
use Freida to find out.

http://www.ama-assn.org/ama/pub/educ...da-online.page
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yes home peds experience is excellent. 3 digit varies. but i will tell you soon.
dude, try IM/PED. also. score cut off is lower than peds. for peds more than 230+ is very competitive. remember peds makes the leasts, very little even less than FM and psych .
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Default competitive

what it means to be competitive ?

many have PMS me asking about competitiveness of their application ?

what make a person competitive ?
yes board score of 250+ is one, but what else. USCE , hand on, volunteering, observershio
p and research are another.
having presentation, posters, books, journals is also excellent.
home country work is good to show no gaps.
connections are also excellent.
visa status is also a major factor.

but in the end great interpersonal skills seals the deal.
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p:s am in USA...on dependent visa....and yes i have a smart doc hubby
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hey shima! are you going to apply this year?? what are u planning to apply in?
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Originally Posted by sparflox View Post
p:s am in USA...on dependent visa....and yes i have a smart doc hubby
your husband has to find you a residency in his hospital or through his connections, get him to knock on some doors , tell people he will be an attending in there hospital, do anything to bring you in.

I am going for things your going , but maybe something more.
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  #40  
Old 06-06-2013
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applying this year . hopefully.
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  #41  
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Originally Posted by docmamun View Post
can you comment on how the year of graduation affect the match. i am a 2005 grad. and i am hearing many negative comments from different sources. what is the PD's point of view in this regard?
it depends , have you been in practice, what are your marks.
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Originally Posted by shima View Post
it depends , have you been in practice, what are your marks.
I am working for the past 8years since 2004 as a medical officer seeing patients everyday and will apear in step 1 in december. what do you suggest to me. what are my chances if I score high.
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Originally Posted by Dr.Albert View Post
I am working for the past 8years since 2004 as a medical officer seeing patients everyday and will apear in step 1 in december. what do you suggest to me. what are my chances if I score high.
good, concentrate on studying, do not get distracted by things like this.

the human minds wants excuse to feel like this.
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  #44  
Old 06-07-2013
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Originally Posted by shima View Post
good, concentrate on studying, do not get distracted by things like this.

the human minds wants excuse to feel like this.
Shima the USMLE CONSULTANT.
Kudos for the great job u doing!
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  #45  
Old 06-07-2013
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Hey I am US IMG , fresh graduate, my step 1 score is 215.
I have 2 US LORs. The score is way less than my nbme's. I going for IM/FM/peds. Am I in a very bad position? Please reply
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Hey I am US IMG , fresh graduate, my step 1 score is 215.
I have 2 US LORs. The score is way less than my nbme's. I going for IM/FM/peds. Am I in a very bad position? Please reply

you are US-IMG, you can apply to programs that DO NOT sponsor visa, so therefor more option.

I think if you put in extra work for Step 2 CK like get 250+ which is veyr easy and almost everyone is getting you will match.

I see you like primary care, make sure you have enough LOR for the programs you apply.

but again, the human mind plays tricks.

Concentrate on STEP 2 CK
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hello guys, i am new at this forum. i would like to ask, is there hope for an old old img to enter any residency training if failed step 1? no visa is needed coz am a us citizen. i have finished residency in my home country and is a diplomate of the specialty society there. i would have lors from my classmates who are consultants now. but is there a chance of getting matched anywhere? what do you think are my chances? pls help. thanks
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Hey nice work there, i am currently observing a doctor who lets me examine patients. Is it ok to do this? And will a lor from DO doctor matter less than one from MD? Thanks
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shima View Post
This thread is to inform us on what the programs need for us to match and how we can be more competitive this year.
[[Please add on, about programs and info you have]]


1a) There are programs that sponsor Visa, and there are programs that do not sponsor Visa.

so we start with VISA

Having a GC will put you on a very nice edge with program that do offer it. But looking at the trend of US-IMG specially those who marry a citizen or go to Carribean schools. Certain program only like those type of graduates.

So having a GC/Citizenship will boost the number of IV, but will you match ? that depends on your marks. Sure you have more IV, but this year so many IMG won the GC as years before. I myself just figured out I might have no problem with Visa
Applicant X [from now on called X]---If you have no Visa issue you still will be ranked based on the importance of the same factors as those with needing Visa. but first lets look at everything in order to figure this out to make our selves more competitive.


Needing Visa:: applicant Y, from now called [Y]
Historically these type of IMG, will study harder in order to beat the mean by 1 SD in at least 1 exam if not both, mark of 250+ in a step 1 has showed these IMG will match the year they apply.

Now comparing X and Y to each other.
X applies to 20 programs, Y applies to 400. Y could apply to more since he has no Visa issues.
Now when Program director wants to IV, if he sponsors Visa he again goes down from the list he made from his pick by using the USMLE mark, specially step 1 mark as filter. He sees 100 people, invites all. For 11 or 12 positions.


Importance of Marks....
=
USMLE Marks --- more than mean 1 SD

---- Marks of 260+ on step 1 usually get IV or over those with 240. and those with 230 are over 220 and 220 over 215.
From a PD I know in a very super friendly program. “we filter based on USMLE marks, SO we look at who has 250+ on step 1. We look at their entire package first in the 3 days I am off. We look for USCE, Visa, and inivte those who meet the criteria first, and the rest later. Almost all the time, we get 1000 applications to our program, after filtering out with marks. We interview 8 per position.”
So yes if an applicant had 260 with no USCE, needing Visa he be invited over someone with 220 who does not need visa.
I hope up to know I was clear.
Now an applicant with 250 with no visa 12 month USCE is ranked and liked more with other qualities I will explain now, over some one with 270 with no USCE, needing no Visa.


Look at this
https://www.aamc.org/download/249322/data/pdws_ug.pdf
also another PD told me this
“We want smart IMG, IMGs with excellent mark , than some AMG who has no Idea about the community problem.

the program director can give marks to anything in you file.


Now Interview:::
60% of your rank comes with this.
If an applicant had 255/245, 12 month USCE but poor interview skills. He is ranked very very low.
But if that applicant has great interpersonal skills, he is ranked very high and with 8 IV and all the interviews being the same people all the time the applicant will match.


Red Flags::
1-Failures in Step 1 [the worst thing in some one careers]
2-215d lower score
3-Scores lower than mean
4-No USCE
5-No US-LOR
6-Failures in Step 2 ck
7-Scores 220 and lower for CK
8-No clinical work after graduation
9-Not being on California’s list of approved schools
10-Failing the CS exam
11-Poor Personal Statement
12-Poor CV
13-Poor Interpersonal skills

These are some of the major red flags.

Now to answer who we can improve our CV for the match.

1-USCE
2-Research
3-Step 3 [for those with low marks, failures]
4-Other countries exam
5-Try to apply within 5 years of graduation if you have red flags

I can’t tell you how to study or hold your hand while you read.
Is your life and no one will put patients in a hand of a doctor who is not knowledgeable.

Now what to do if you do not match.
1-Marry some one smart and get them to match , they will bring you in for sure.
2-Do MSc.
3-Research for life
4-Work for pharmaceutical companies
The best solution to all these is Join a Program that helps you get all this in one shot - and as they say there is nothing like a Free Lunch, you get what you pay for !!! I joined - I completed - I matched - I start residency, July 1 2014.

No Interviews? No Match in 2014? – A program that takes you closer for the 2015 match

See you all here at Miami.
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